Some Comments from Peter Molyneux About BW2

Kays

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This is something I found on the LoinheadHead site (not LHS) which I found interesting. It's an interview with Peter Molyneux where he makes a few comments on BW2

http://www.loinhead.net/2007/05/20/exclusive-with-molyneux



You’ve said why you felt it went bad, but what was actually bad about the game itself?

Right. That’s a list, and it’s a list of kinda my failures - which I have to take responsibility for, obviously - but also just the position and situation that we were in and you know, forced to finish the game. And that’s the biggest flaw, not having the time to finish the game. Even though it was in development for a long time. It was rushed at the end, we didn’t have time to balance it and play it.

Is it true that you had to start again from scratch after a certain time in development?

That, that - it sounds like a really bad thing, doesn’t it. Starting again - we didn’t actually start again - that implies that you walk into the office one day and you haven’t got anything, but there were certain features that had to be thrown away and redone, and the reason for that was that, this is what’s so stupid about games development, it can be one tiny little decision that you make that can end up totally ruining the entire thing. And one of the tiny decisions that we made in Black and White 2 was to use Black and White 1 as the foundation stone for all the code for Black and White 2, and what we found was you had this massive amount of code and you were putting an even more massive amount of code on top, and underneath it was this quite shaky foundation stone, and that meant we had to rewrite quite a lot of stuff. And then it came down that the original plan for Black and White 2 - we thought we had it on time, but we didn’t, we ran out of money to produce really - was that it was gonna be twenty-five lands, I think, fifteen to twenty-five lands, the creatures’ intelligence could have been much more, we had a real plan to stretch the features out so that you didn’t get them all by land, you know, third land I think it was, stretch those features out, there was an awful lot more about the RTSy side of the game, an awful more about the army side. So you know, if you were going to turn round to me now and say, what are your biggest regrets? I think one of my biggest regrets is that whole time of Black and White 2, you know, I wish I could go back to the start of the development of Black and White 2, start from a blank sheet of paper and plan to make it better.

How do you feel, now, about the creature sliders to control the mind?

Well, it was a really good idea, if it had been implemented fully. What that turned out to be, that idea wasn’t balanced enough I don’t think. That was a leading question, wasn’t it?

Yeah.

What did you feel about the sliders?

I don’t think they worked. They ruined the creature as a person.

Agreed.



 
I meant to put a link onto that when I spotted it, but I got side-tracked.  Still, like I said on the other forums - Good Interview.

It didn't try to bleed out answers we knew we weren't going to get (that much) and still managed to be quite informative :yes .
 
[bq]How do you feel, now, about the creature sliders to control the mind?

Well, it was a really good idea, if it had been implemented fully. What that turned out to be, that idea wasn’t balanced enough I don’t think. That was a leading question, wasn’t it?

Yeah.

What did you feel about the sliders?

I don’t think they worked. They ruined the creature as a person.

Agreed.
[/bq]

Meh.  I got so frustrated with my creature in BW1 (especially when trying to play multiplayer) that I found it a relief to be able to see what I was teaching it.  I used the creature in BW2 a ton more than in BW1.
 
I think that there were mixed feelings about the sliders. I believe that if they had things properly balanced that there might of been greater acceptance of them.
 
the creature in bw2 seemed lobotimized, bw2 was a dissapointment overall. 
 
"lobotimized" that's one way of describing them.

I perfer "wind up toy" Just set the sliders and let it go.
 
Teaching pets tricks would be easy with sliders...
 
*cough* pardon


that said...

i find the sliders irritating because it dumbed down creature training.

why is that a bad thing?

because, when you get your creatures sliders where you want them... thats it, nooooo sense of accomplishment.

and the same goes for this crummy 'tribute system'.
buying a miracle for your creature gives you no sense of accomplishment at all!

you could actually teach miracles to your creature in bw1, and you would see the perplexed look on his face and laugh.

then there was the creature growth, as soon as you hit land 3 he is almost fully grown. in black and white 1 you could actually grow your creature, and when your  tiny critter turned into a full blown titan you could look at him and say "wow i raised that"


nuff said (FOR NOW)
 
Perhaps it would have been better to have done it both ways to cater to people who liked the BW1 creature training.  I don't know if this would have been possible, but maybe some way to "turn off" the sliders and let you train your creature in the BW1 way.
 
Also, I dont want to call it "customize", but in bw1 you can control and train even weird little actions like kicking trees, or throwing poop and rocks or pigs and what it would throw them at (the game i started recently my creature noticed those birds flying around and was going after them with rocks). or things like sleeping under your temple or how well it fights without you there clicking. Your creature would mimic and complement your playstyle even if you were not in the screen (and you trained it right). In bw2 the creature is just robot on a mission.
 
What I liked about creature training in BW1 is that it wasn't perfect. There was always a bit of randomness involved. Unless you kept a constant eye on your creature and gave him direction there's always the chance that he'll do something unexpected.
 
Kays said:
What I liked about creature training in BW1 is that it wasn't perfect. There was always a bit of randomness involved. Unless you kept a constant eye on your creature and gave him direction there's always the chance that he'll do something unexpected.
Nicely described there.  That's pretty much the nail on the head for what I liked about the B&W1 creatures too :yes .
 
Kays said:
What I liked about creature training in BW1 is that it wasn't perfect. There was always a bit of randomness involved. Unless you kept a constant eye on your creature and gave him direction there's always the chance that he'll do something unexpected.

yes indeed.   my creature havoc is a stable creature, but his behavior changes like the seasons, hes always off messing with the villagers.

.... or eating them
 
Nice to see what Peter Molyneux has to say.

I liked both games, to tell the truth. Black and White 2 was rather detailed and made teaching your creature easier, but Black and White 1 had more character. It had trail and error, and challenged you a little more. Also, back when it first came out, B&W1 it was more "out there" and "one of a kind".

If only there was someway to mix them together...
 
yes plus i enjoyed plus i loved CI and i miss that time of expansion where freedom is true with it..i mena bw2 BOG is so hard i mena i love buildign up a  city and watching no one actually try  taking it i mean! I STILL HAV EYET TO GET PAST LAND 1(or 2 depending ion how you look at it) on th eexpansion i mena ocm eon! th egod is much much harder too hard..although i liek d th elsiders..i didn't liek the robot that wa smy creature though...i mean realy and tribute for building..hmph... i man armies wa s bit of a stretch but i love dthe buildign i really did it mad eme actually FEEL like a god then but the fact i had to constantly defend did alway sput me off a bit
 
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